Tuesday, June 2, 2020

Clarification

There is no argument you can make that justifies kneeling on the neck on a handcuffed suspect when there are four policemen on scene and the suspect is already controlled.

None of the rioting or looting or distractions after the fact change the tyrannical nature of the behavior of those policemen at that moment. 

George Floyd was murdered under the color of law.

Quis custodiet ipsos custodes? 
--Juvenal, Roman Poet, 2nd Century C.E.

12 comments:

Aesop said...

Natzsofast, Guido:

Did Floyd die in custody? Yes.
Were those officers @$$holes? Yes.
Did anything they did kill him? No one knows.

If it turns out he died because of a surfeit of methamphetamine or cocaine, and bad heart stressed out by being arrested, and not from knee on neck therapy, it's going to piss off the BLM lynch mob, and leave a lot of knee-jerk "Hang the bastards!" parrots with silly looks on their faces, right before their Emily Litella Award nomination.

The standard rule in the ER is that anybody yelling "I can't breathe!" is both F.O.S., nor overburdened with any common sense grasp of the mechanics of speech, and the F.O. stands for "Full Of...". I'll let you work the rest out for yourself. But neither does it rule out that he was having a heart attack which ultimately stopped his lifelong crime spree.

Failing to notice your custodial perp had gone all floppy for several minutes may meet the standard for negligent manslaughter, but until I see a crystal clear beyond a shadow autopsy that leaves no doubt that the knee was what killed Mr. Dindu, I ain't buying the media/BLM narrative in any way, shape, or form.

It absolutely deserves to be refered for investigation, even prosecution, but Died in Custody ╪ Killed By Cops, even in this instance.

Richard said...

As we all know first reports are always wrong, especially when filtered by the media. How about we wait for the investigation to sort things out.

Divemedic said...

I agree with both Aesop and Richard.
Did he die in custody? Yes.
Was what the officers did wrong and illegal? Probably. (I can think of a couple of scenarios where it could go the other way.)
Did the officers cause his death? Undetermined. Correlation does not equal causation.

That is why we have trials. Let the process run its course.

ASM826 said...

You try kneeling on someone's neck for 9 minutes, have them die, and then say it underlying conditions that caused the death. The jury would be back before lunch.

Borepatch said...

Just to amplify what ASM826 said: the District Attorney didn't want to charge the officers, but was forced to by the political situation. The DA would have charged you or me in a New York Minute.

Two justice systems is part of the reason that America is burning.

B said...

Nah, if he could complain that loudly about "I can't breathe" the he COULD breathe.

You don't know what happened or why he was being restrained, nor why they had to keep trying to hold him down. Why 4 or more cops were holding him down.

I wanna see the other video.

Not generally a fan of cops, but I doubt they restrained him for no reason.

Don't wanna get fucked up when under arrest? STOP FIGHTING once it becomes clear yer gonna get arrested.

You are usually more objective than this. The media message must be getting through your filters.

Aesop said...

Let's recall that this was a guy with a prior conviction for armed robbery during home invasion, and under arrest for passing counterfeit, such that 4 cops were even necessary.

The was not Pastor Dindu Nuffin on his way to deposit his Sunday church offerings at the local bank, when The man suddenly decided they hate black people, and decided to just up and kill one.

When the autopsy undoes the "they killed him" narrative, lay in a supply of seasoning for that hearty luncheon of crow. and ammunition when the other Dindus pull Riot 2.0.

Should this go to investigation, and probably trial? Yes.
Is it a slam dunk? Hell no.

Desk Sgt. Wisdom 101: "No matter how flat the pancake is, there's always two sides."

Richard said...

It always amazes me how many conservatives are willing to accept the media spin without waiting for the facts. This is why we lose.

FredLewers said...

I read something that two cops were there to deal with other people (associates? Hostile bystanders?)
Once he's restrained (and if it took 8 minutes to cuff him up, they're clearly incompetent. And ain't nobody winded from a chase either) then put the perp in the back of the cruiser or sit him on the curb... Kneeling on him for eight minutes is uncalled for IMHO.
But for someone to even think they can get away with that behavior is an indictment of the organization in general and his immediate chain of command in particular. It's gonna be an ugly summer.

Glen Filthie said...

Hmmmmmmmmm.

The guy’s got a rap sheet a mile long. He’s done real damage to people, theft mostly. That’s just the stuff they know about. The justice system as it stands now, protects such men. They get a scam of a trial, some leftist judicial poseurs do their virtue signal - and the guy’s out on the street again stealing, endangering others or worse. You can’t make the argument that “due process” and “a fair trial” are part of the justice system anymore.

Sorry, no chits given. Had he been a good man, the case would be different.

Divemedic said...

@Fred: Read what happened. Floyd resisted being put in the car. It's obvious you haven't read the criminal complaint that was filed against Chauvin:


STATEMENT OF PROBABLE CAUSE
On May 25, 2020, someone called 911 and reported that a man bought merchandise from Cup Foods at 3759 Chicago Avenue in Minneapolis, Hennepin County, Minnesota with a counterfeit $20 bill.
At 8:08p.m., Minneapolis Police Department (MPD) Officers Thomas Lane and J.A. Kueng arrived with their body worn cameras (BWCs) activated and running. The officers learned from store personnel that the man who passed the counterfeit $20 was parked in a car around the corner from the store on 38th Street.

BWC video obtained by the Minnesota Bureau of Criminal Apprehension shows that the officers approached the car, Lane on the driver’s side and Kueng on the passenger side. Three people were in the car; George Floyd was in the driver’s seat, a known adult male was in the passenger seat and a known adult female was sitting in the backseat.

As Officer Lane began speaking with Mr. Floyd, he pulled his gun out and pointed it at Mr. Floyd’s open window and directed Mr. Floyd to show his hands. When Mr. Floyd put his hands in the steering wheel, Lane put his gun back in its holster. While Officer Kueng was speaking with the front seat passenger, Officer Lane ordered Mr. Floyd out of the car, put his hands on Mr. Floyd, and pulled him out of the car.

Officer Lane handcuffed Mr. Floyd. Mr. Floyd actively resisted being handcuffed. Once handcuffed, Mr. Floyd became compliant and walked with Officer Lane to the sidewalk and sat on the ground at Officer Lane’s direction. In a conversation that lasted just under two minutes, Officer Lang asked Mr. Floyd for his name and identification. Officer Lane asked Mr. Lloyd if he was “on anything” and explained that he was arresting Mr. Lloyd for passing counterfeit currency.

Officers Kueng and Lane stood Mr. Floyd up and attempted to walk Mr. Floyd to their squad car (MPD 320)at 8:14 p.m. Mr. Floyd stiffened up, fell to the ground, and told the officers he was claustrophobic.

MPD Officers Derek Chauvin (the defendant) and Tou Thoa then arrived in a separate squad car.The officers made several attempts to get Mr. Floyd in the backseat of squad 320 from the driver’s side. Mr. Floyd did not voluntarily get in the car and struggled with the officers by intentionally falling down, saying he was not going in the car, and refusing to stand still.

Mr. Floyd is over six feet tall and weighs more than 200 pounds. While standing outside the car, Mr. Floyd began saying and repeating that he could not breathe. The defendant went to the passenger side and tried to get Mr. Floyd into the car from that side and Lane and Kueng assisted.

Wayne said...

ASM826 is right. Borepatch is right.

Aesop is his usual arrogant self. No surprise there.